While admitting at the top of Friday's NBC Today that there
was "no clear winner" in Thursday's vice presidential debate, minutes
later, co-hosts Matt Lauer and Savannah Guthrie brought on left-wing
MSNBC host Rachel Maddow to declare Joe Biden the victor: "Democrats
are psyched that Joe Biden had such a great night....most Democrats
watching last night probably think that Joe Biden clearly won." [Listen to the audio [1]]
Lauer teed up Maddow perfectly: "Going into this debate, just about
everybody said the main goal of Joe Biden was to steady the ship and
calm the nerves on the Democratic side. Let's start there, did he
accomplish it?" Not surprisingly, Maddow replied: "Absolutely." The
headline on the screen throughout the segment posed the question: "Did
Biden Blunt the Romney Momentum?"
Guthrie pushed back on Maddow's assertions: "I think the analysis that
there's no clear winner is because of Joe Biden's style, his
demeanor...Do you think that Biden was over-amped, overly aggressive,
and that detracted from his performance?" Maddow ran to the Vice
President's defense: "Biden's aggression, I think, was both expected
from him, and the laughing thing was essentially implicit messaging,
'Don't believe what this guy is saying, I can't believe this guy.'"
Teeing up Maddow yet again, Lauer followed with: "Well, on the subject
of what you can believe from Paul Ryan, his calling card, he's a numbers
guy, okay? So on the subjects of the economy, jobs, spending, taxes,
how did he do?"
Maddow eagerly slammed Ryan: "He had a couple of problems on basic
numbers issues. When he tried to make the case that the unemployment
rate is going up, when he made the case about Scranton versus
Janesville, it was stylistically interesting because Biden jumped in so
aggressively to shut him down."
In his next question, Lauer continued to offer Maddow the opportunity
to go after Ryan: "This was his first major test on a stage like this.
Did we learn anything about Paul Ryan last night that will impact the
election?"
Maddow ranted:
Yes, and that's what I think is so exciting about this debate, whoever you want to win. What was exciting about it is that all this new ground was covered, mostly by Joe Biden pinning Paul Ryan down on stuff that we weren't sure if the Romney/Ryan ticket was gonna stick with. He is in favor of privatizing Social Security, he is in favor of overturning Roe vs. Wade and making abortion criminal.
Guthrie made one final attempt to bring some balance to exchange:
"Obviously you think Biden won, but would you acknowledge that Ryan
passed the threshold test, proving that he would a plausible vice
president and president, if the need arose?" A snarky Maddow sneered:
"On everything except foreign policy. Honestly I think that Paul Ryan
was very clearly out of his depth on foreign policy. Maybe it wasn't
fair to have him with a foreign correspondent moderator and former
chairman of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee there talking so much
about foreign policy."
Claiming to want "another perspective" on the debate, Lauer and Guthrie
turned to radio talk show host and Obama supporter Michael Smerconish, a
frequent regular on MSNBC.
Unlike Maddow, Smerconish was more even-handed in his review,
observing: "Paul Ryan turned in a very strong performance....Joe Biden
is very skilled in that realm, but there's no shame in Paul Ryan's
performance....probably each of the bases got what they were looking for
out of that debate."
However, like Maddow, Smerconish ultimately gave the win to Biden:
"...the big momentum has clearly been on the Republican side of the
ledger. I think that was thwarted last night, and what Joe Biden did was
set the table for the next presidential debate."
Here is a full transcript of the October 12 interview with Maddow:
7:06AM ET
MATT LAUER: Rachel Maddow is the host of the – of MSNBC's The Rachel Maddow Show.
And you two were up late working last night, so coffee's on me. Going
into this debate, just about everybody said the main goal of Joe Biden
was to steady the ship and calm the nerves on the Democratic side. Let's
start there, did he accomplish it?
[ON-SCREEN HEADLINE: Going Forward; Did Biden Blunt the Romney Momentum?]
RACHEL
MADDOW: Absolutely. I mean, Democrats are psyched that Joe Biden had
such a great night. And you said at the top that there was no clear
winner, and that may be, but it was very important for the Democrats
that Paul Ryan not be the clear winner. And I think most Democrats, and I
don't know about independent voters, but most Democrats watching last
night probably think that Joe Biden clearly won.
SAVANNAH GUTHRIE: I think the analysis that there's no clear winner is
because of Joe Biden's style, his demeanor, and if we've learned
anything from these debates is that those things matter as much as
substance, occasionally more. Do you think that Biden was over-amped,
overly aggressive, and that detracted from his performance?
MADDOW: It definitely seemed like aggression and not like a cool
distancing from the proceedings, which I think was the problem with the
President's performance, in terms of his style the first time around.
Biden's aggression, I think, was both expected from him, and the
laughing thing was essentially implicit messaging, "Don't believe what
this guy is saying, I can't believe this guy." It actually sort of had a
messaging function rather than just being a display of his emotions.
LAUER: Well, on the subject of what you can believe from Paul Ryan, his
calling card, he's a numbers guy, okay? So on the subjects of the
economy, jobs, spending, taxes, how did he do?
MADDOW: He had a couple of problems on basic numbers issues. When he
tried to make the case that the unemployment rate is going up, when he
made the case about Scranton versus Janesville, it was stylistically
interesting because Biden jumped in so aggressively to shut him down.
But it's true that the unemployment rate is below 8% now and being
unwilling to admit that, I think, put him maybe on sort of shaky ground.
Obviously he's very comfortable talking about these issues. The fact
that the debate focused so much on foreign policy, was not Paul Ryan's
wheelhouse, and I think that spoke to Mr. Biden's strengths. But, you
know, those issues, they both feel confident when they're talking about
the middle class. It's a question, I think, of whether or not it
resonates.
LAUER: Okay, we know Joe Biden, okay? Americans know him. They watched
him in the Senate, they've watched him now for almost four years as vice
president. Not as many people know Paul Ryan. This was his first major
test on a stage like this. Did we learn anything about Paul Ryan last
night that will impact the election?
MADDOW: Yes, and that's what I think is so exciting about this debate,
whoever you want to win. What was exciting about it is that all this new
ground was covered, mostly by Joe Biden pinning Paul Ryan down on stuff
that we weren't sure if the Romney/Ryan ticket was gonna stick with. He
is in favor of privatizing Social Security, he is in favor of
overturning Roe vs. Wade and making abortion criminal. On Afghanistan,
nobody has pressed them on Afghanistan. Now we know they are going to
stick to the 2014 deadline, but they also think that deadline is
dangerous and a bad idea. I mean that's the sign of a campaign that
hasn't been pressed very much on that issue, that it made so little
sense when they finally had to.
GUTHRIE: Very quickly, obviously you think Biden won, but would you
acknowledge that Ryan passed the threshold test, proving that he would a
plausible vice president and president, if the need arose?
MADDOW: On everything except foreign policy. Honestly I think that Paul
Ryan was very clearly out of his depth on foreign policy. Maybe it
wasn't fair to have him with a foreign correspondent moderator and
former chairman of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee there talking
so much about foreign policy. There, I think, he bottomed out, but other
than that I think he did fine.
LAUER: Rachel, thank you very much.
MADDOW: Thank you.
LAUER: We'll see you tonight at 9 on MSNBC.